Over the years I have read and have done some reasearch, so now I lay this out to all of you. It is believed that chrildren that are molested as youth will one day marry or be drawn to these kinds of people , if this be true then why do they not have the sence to know these and get away from them? do you believe that this is right or wrong? I know that we as pagans see many different perspectives when it comes to liveing life, but is their a limit? I have often seen this handed down through generations first at the hands of their parents and now them selfs , what makes people do this? or is it that we still live in the past where sex was ok with anyone or any thing or person reguardless of age or gender. I may not answer all of you just looking for perspective here and what other think , I dont do debates , but I do follow the therads without others notice . I know this is a deep subject matter , but in such a modern world is this truly alright? no gripes, no BSing , just your perspective . Thanks MP Fantumofthewinds
I am not sure if my thought is exclusive to child molesters, but I am convinced that as people that when 'we' start out our lives; relationships and such, that 'we' seek out people that we're familiar with or can relate to, sadly in the case of a dysfunctional person, that is usually the sort of person that created that dysfunction within us.
I think that the only way to break that sort of chain is a change of mindset, in my opinion as long as a person's mindset remains a certain way, they will continue to be attracted to and attract people of a certain type; not to mention in the way that those people deal with others is directly in a manner that is displayed by that particular victim.
I can never really gauge right or wrong in that particular context, from a personal perspective, I believe it to be 'wrong', but overly I think it speaks bigger volumes that the person in question needs to seek counseling or other help to help them understand what they're doing and the situations that they're finding themselves in. I think that is in part why they don't have the sense to see it or move on from it, if they were dealing with this sort of thing from childhood, then could overly recognize that something was wrong from their own experience ? I don't think until their mindset had changed.
Interesting thoughts, and something very important and worth discussion.
I mostly agree with you Sin, I'd say though that it's not that people don't care about others, but more that we don't think to care about others. People are inherently self absorbed, & think their experience is more or less what everyone's experience is like. A dude may be aware that some people have had trauma done to them, but unless it's thrust in his face he will never conceive that it could have happened to someone he knows. Before I was born a relative got raped when she was 12, and her own brother had no idea until he was an adult (same was true about another sister who got pregnant in high school & was then whisked away to some kind of teen mama babycamp), he was the youngest had no idea that this had even happened inside his own family. But it wasn't his fault, he was just a kid and nobody ever thought to tell him.
Adults are like that too. I've known people who grew up without any major abusive event who are equally blissfully ignorant. They know it happens, but it just doesn't happen to them or anyone they know, and when they find out that it does and has they often just don't know how to react.
That said, not all children who were molested grow up to be molesters... I think but it does hinder them in how they raise their own kids. Said relative was very detached to her kids when they were growing up, & is still but a little less so. I also think that someone can grow up to molest without having that history in his or her own family. I think it's a perversion/sickness that once done may never be undone, but hopefully monitored.
I think they pedophiles do it because of power. You get this kid, and you can manipulate the kid into doing what you want because you're the adult and they're supposed to believe and trust you. It's not an equal exchange, and the folks at NAMBLA want to convince people that it is, that the kid understands and even wants it, and that makes it ok.
I'm not going to pass judgment on when it's ok for kids to start experimenting with sex. It depends on the individual, however I'd say that most teenagers are not ready for the consequences of having sex (aka a baby), which is why I'd vote for sex education. More you know right?
I had friends in high school that also were sexually active when they were 12, 13, 14... and one in particular who went after college age guys. She also ended up having an abortion as a teen, and never remained faithful to any male, even after she got married and had kids (but then she's a special kind of train wreck). My whole bit is, What kind of actual relationship can an adult have with a child that isn't completely unequal? It's not like those college age guys could bring my 14 yr old friend to visit their parents or vica versa. Chances are he wasn't going to go to prom -w- her... Also what kind of relationships is he going to have as he ages? Why he gotta go after jail-bait instead of women closer to his own age who can meet him as an equal? And as a female would I ever want a guy who thought it was ok to have sex with a minor? If the age difference was subtle, like a year or two that's one thing, but five, six or more years when the kid is still in middle or high school and the adult is living in his own place? Is the kid really cognizant enough to understand the consequences to their life as well as their partner? He or she could get pregnant, their partner could go to jail, have to be on a national registry, and have trouble finding work that'll pay a damn. Can't the coitus wait a few years? Can't these kids explore with someone their own age? I'm in my 30's, and I've caught myself eyeing 19-20 yr olds, but I wouldn't take an interest in anyone younger than that sexually. Besides I'd rather my sex partners be able to buy their own beer.
Thanks Sin very deep and honest, but I meet a man he was and had 4 counts of molestation, these being his own blood [daughters] who later brought charges against him, after his sentenceing I asked him really why he did such a thing , did you not think of the mental and emotion applications of your actions ? he told me he was just teaching them about sex? I about hit the floor. Fantumofthewinds
I was thinking along the same lines , but thats just me , I never ask I was just floored by the answer. I dont know if this trate or what ever it is called gos away , I was always told or at least though it stays with one sometimes like a sickness or like us with our habit of coffee lol. I dont have a clue and was looking for others thoughts on the matter. if its not teaching then what? why? and please tell me the turn on? call me dumb lol. Fantumofthewinds
All this talk of peace, unity, compassion, empathy, sympathy, and tolerance - it's all bullshit.
This is the only statement I don't agree with Sin. As you know I am a positive person, yes I was sexual abused by my father. From the age of 5 till I was 12. It did affect me as when I was a teenager I left home and went on my own. I had to overcome it and I did. I find nothing wrong with having compassion for another who has been hurt or abused. If someone dies you say their shouldn't be sympathy? This is just my opinion Sin and I do respect your's. Some of the things you have stated are very true.
You do say that people fixate on you and I think it is because you are very open with your mind and have a lot of different views on topics.
Personally, I think it's wrong, I'm way over protective of who's around. I do notice that other negative people that have influenced me, that I seem to end up in those situations, but that's personal issue, not anything about this topic. I have heard of that situation though when it's familial, so that might be different, I don't know.
I agree BJT, Good Goddess, haven't they been though enough without being chatised about it.
Those who are weak need support sometimes to overcome. Others are strong and can put it away for good as I did.
"It is believed that chrildren that are molested as youth will one day marry or be drawn to these kinds of people , if this be true then why do they not have the sence to know these and get away from them?"
I have to say, this is the first time I have ever heard this and I have researched this subject very deeply. Of course, I stick mostly to text books and doctors who would not make such a statement. I have heard the common - false - belief that people who were molested will molest children when they grow up. The problem is the complexity of the issue. It is irresponsible and frankly unfair to have such blanket statements as these. Every situation should be dealt with on a case by case basis. There are many determining factors as to whether or not this will be true.
Attraction to people is a complex and intriguing subject. In the book "Getting the Love You Want" by Dr. Harville Hendrix, he talks a great deal about why we are attracted to the people we are attracted to. It is mostly based on what our subconscious mind deems as "safe" and what childhood wounds we see the other person can heal. Body language, facial expressions and many other factors help us make a quick judgment when first meeting a person. Fight or flight kicks in if the person is using mannerisms that make us feel uncomfortable.
In the case of someone who has been molested, I have seen a molestation victim quickly pick up on the fact that someone was a pedophile. It took a matter of hours for them to recognize all the behavior in the other person. The person they believed to be a pedophile is now a convicted pedophile. The ability to recognize the behaviors and pin point the problem was uncanny. Do you really think someone like that would marry a child molester?
It is such a complex issue that saying that is the case for everyone or, well, anyone for that matter, is asinine. Has the person had any help? Has the person broke away from the abuse, knowing it was wrong? Did they stay in it or had no options for leaving? What was the situation for that individual? The psychology of sexual abuse is an incredibly complex field that has many levels and faces and many questions have to be asked. Once again, it is horrifically complex in every way and to act like molestation victims should do this or do that is ignorant babble. Every case is different because of the individual and their personal experiences with the molestation and other external influences. We, as a community, can not shut a door on someone because they are a spouse of a molestation victim or a molestation victim. If people listened to that sentence (and others expressed here) all spouses of molestation victims and molestation victims would be look on with suspicion. That is only fear mongering that has no place in a community built around acceptance.
I suggest finding some new sources of information. There are many books on the subject of molestation and relationships in general.
I told you this was a deep subject matter, now I know that their are 1900,00 of us here and most of us educated. no Im not a psychology major thats why I brough this forth , if I was and wanted information from a book sarry I would go their , I dont mean by any means to condem this is not my place , but I did want real expressions as well as thoughts from real people , thats not to say some book writter is not real, but the more facts one has the more one learns , it was a topic that really got to me as I sat their and lishened to this man. I said nothing about shuting the door . so you believe people change ? even molesters? and would you want them next door to you? just common questions here and Im sure these have raced in everyones mind , a general consences and understanding and thats what Im looking for . Have a good day . Fantumofthewinds