ok...here goes...i hate cliches...i really really really hate cliches...even down here in the underground i hate cliches...i mean really...i cant stand seeing these all over the place; fairies, drum circles, cloaks, "scary spooky" screen names, anything to do with charmed or twilight, vampires in general, angels (very high on my s-list), wolf totems (your spirit animal is the cockroach get over it), trying to act all mystical and mysterious, did i meantion cloaks?, "mystical" pen names (theres one in particular that bugs me but shes uber popular so i guess id better keep that to myself) i mean i just cannot take you seriously if you go by johnny winter winds or mary starchild...yawwwwwwnnnnnn...i guess i'll post soon about names and identity in general but i just wanted to get that off my chest...sometimes i feel so very solitary because i just cannot accept these (to me) out moded and out dated symbols...so should i just turn in my pagan card now? cancel my membership because i reject these things that so many cherish?
i got to really thinking about this as i was reading the june esbat in sandra kynes otherwise incredible book and im thinking to myself "really? drum circle?"...as a music lover and devotee it disturbs my musical soul to endure a bunch of stoned hippies (hey now i am very very very liberal) do a drum circle to whatever "rhythm" is in thie rheads...same with tone deaf pagans...no thanks...i find the whole concept of a drum circle to be cultural thievery as well...its like taking from a particular people but not really giving back to that culture..but we're honoring it by using it in our path...no youre trampling all over it with your co-opting...its like when hot topic sells punk and goth stuff; it looks and sound punky gothic but when you scratch off the thin veneer the heart is gone...im not going to say stop doing it because i know it helps many...im just stating that for me, in this path, im good thanks...just to let you know however that to compromise in the background i will be playing peter gabriel's rhythm of the heat...oh i hear you screaming at that one but someday i'll write about that...
anyway thats me..am i a "new" type of pagan? or just some cliched hipster trying to be all different...
thom

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Ok, I've watched it, Anna. It's an alternative medicine ("made-up sciences" as it states in the clip), so of course you will get the yay-sayers and the neigh-sayers. I don't agree with kids being manipulated, but I've seen worse. This is a clearly biased opinion, so Penn and Teller are put into that category for me.

On a personal note, I use ear candles on myself and I know that they have been disproved medically. I use them and feel they work, so what do I do considering they hold no scientific validity? I go by instinct and keep using them =)
Penn and Teller are biased certainly, but they're just the spokespeople. The researchers on the show do a pretty good job imo.

Placebos work too, btw. It's a mind over matter thing I think.

There's a pretty cool website that this reminds me of. Care to take a look? It shows the harm of alternative medicine.

http://whatstheharm.net/
I gave it a gander and like everything else, it's biased, Anna. You have to view all this with an open mind and understand that it could actually all be nonsense. I have had loads of acupuncture and it was the only thing that cured a pain I used to suffer from in my ankle, that and radar treatment. The doctors were useless. This does not mean all doctors are useless, but I am saying that acupuncture in this instance most definitely beat anything modern Western medicine could do. Here in Finland it gets really dry in the wintertime so people's sinuses often get infected and this is why I use ear candles. I also use quite a bit of tiger balm for various ailments and it works. Mind over matter is a great thing as long as you use it as it should be. Some people are just always ill and treat illness like a cry for attention.

There is harm in drinking too much water, you know, and it's safer to neck ecstasy than it is taking aspirin, and there's more chance of you falling off a donkey and being killed than being in a fatal car accident... ;)
So a non credible source and biased opinion.....nose bedays work too for allergies....What is an ear candle?
You burn a wax tube on your ear. It's supposed to draw out illness or something.
My daughter got one of those when she came here to visit because her allergies went whacko and it really did work!! I was surprised!
I tend to see things on the energy levels too,as ALL things use,work with and manipulate energies. i know very little too about Chiros,just folks that have gone and their success stories,so obviously it is NOT all bullshit....BWITCH is a Reiki healer,I'll ask her
Testimonies aren't credible imo. Plenty of people give testimonials on things that don't work. Just take a look at those dick enhancements ads.
Testimonies aren't credible imo. Plenty of people give testimonials on things that don't work. Just take a look at those dick enhancements ads.

In your opinion, Anna. Have you ever had a gnosis?
Saying something is my opinion after I say something is my opinion is a bit superfluous, don't you think?


UPG is applicable only to the person who has the UPG, and no one else.

Otherwise I'd be christian from all the christian testimonials I've heard. Their personal experiences are fine for them, just as mine are fine for me, but neither should be used to influence others.
Saying something is my opinion after I say something is my opinion is a bit superfluous, don't you think?

Not in this case. I was highlighting that this was *merely* your opinion. Hopefully you got that.

UPG is applicable only to the person who has the UPG, and no one else.

But would you call that person's UPG bullshit and instantly render it redundant?

Otherwise I'd be christian from all the christian testimonials I've heard. Their personal experiences are fine for them, just as mine are fine for me, but neither should be used to influence others.

But they do, Anna. Surely you aren't so naïve? We aren't all completely atomised that we are not open to influence, are we?
Has she ever studied medicine? Does she have her doctorate? Though I may not have my degree, I started studying medicine at the age of 12. (I was bored). I went in to be a Phys. Therapist. I did not finish my degree, because of a bad advisor, however, I do still read studies, and I do still keep learning.
The mind is a powerful tool, that is true, and yes, when endorphines from the brain are released, because something is said to work, and the mind so believes it to be so, the healing begins, through the mind.
However, discounting what work those in the Chiropractic field do, is not fully right. After all, have you lived with pain so bad, that you cannot walk (I have, and have a wheelchair in my home for my worst days.) Do you know what it is like to have nerves pinched so badly by the bones surrounding them, that even your bladder or bowel is affected? Do you know what it is like to have compression injuries to the neck that cause you to awaken paralyzed?
I do, I live with it daily, and though I do not regularly go to the Chiropractor, I have found relief from the pain and paralysis when the bones are placed back where they belong. I have watched as my husband looked like a human pretzel from a fall off his big rig, while the chiropractor adjusted him, making both his legs the same length, and his back straight again. I have seen tears well up in his eyes, as the relief from the pain and the deformation of muscle and bones was repaired.
They may not be able to cure disease, but they can aid in the livability of those diseases that cause pain. Alleviating the nerves from pressure, does help the body to retain the normal functions that were affected by the deformity in the first place. And there are those who work with scoliosis, who have been able to reverse the affects of the degenerative disease that causes it in the first place.
So no, it is not completely a pseudo-science. You have to know not only the bones of the human body, but every nerve and what functions of the body they affect, and chiros are very good at diagnosing diseases that are affecting a person, that some doctors have missed, as they were not looking at a neurological cause.

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